Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/Failed log/July 2020

The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was archived by Giants2008 via FACBot (talk) 01:03, 20 July 2020 (UTC) [1].[reply]

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Nominator(s): Chidgk1 (talk) 11:00, 6 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this for featured list because these power stations are the main contributor to greenhouse gas emissions by Turkey so it would be great if someone at COP26 could discuss them. As this is my first attempt to get anything featured I suspect there may be a lot I need to improve.Chidgk1 (talk) 11:00, 6 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Very nice list, hopefully it'll be deleted someday for being empty.

Thanks. I got the idea from List of active coal fired power stations in the United Kingdom and List of coal fired power stations in Australia and once this one is featured I hope others will copy the format. Although Global Energy Monitor have a useful world list I guess they have to put most of their effort into the biggest countries like China and are not able to include the smaller power stations.

• The hatnotes links can be included as in-line or see also links, not needed at the very top for disambiguation

Done

• -> "so the plants are the largest"

Done

• I could follow the note on searching the main source, but perhaps you could give the translations for the selection names and/or link directly to a translated version. Not sure if there's a guideline for this.

Done (but when I tried to search from the translated version it just hung)

• Three say local coal – I see this is what the database says but should be lignite right? All the same for the Soma plants.

You are almost certainly right but I have not yet found a source to cite to confirm that

• What's the point of having the license number? Seems like internal data of no use to the public.

This is because the names can change with change of ownership or in sources can sometimes be confusingly different for the same plant or confusingly similar for different plants (for example Soma and Bekirli)

• "Note:" is not necessary

Done

• The linked page doesn't actually have details about capacity payments: The table marks a number and eligibility but I don't know how to interpret it.

I can easily change the column heading from "Capacity Mechanism Payment (₺m)" to "Capacity Mechanism Payment (millions of lira)" or somesuch if you think that is clearer.

Reywas92^Talk 20:36, 6 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Is there anything more I need to improve on this please?Chidgk1 (talk) 14:36, 26 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I think you need to resolve the discrepancy in [Note 1] at the top, but otherwise I don't see any further issues. Reywas92^Talk 23:02, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry I am afraid I don't have update access to government websites! I just checked the Turkish page and it says 68 "santraller" which definitely means "plants" not "units". But I cannot believe that is right. If you like I will write to the ministry and ask but I doubt they would reply.Chidgk1 (talk) 14:24, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

However I wonder if we should have a row for each unit like the Global Energy Monitor database. Does anyone have an opinion on that? Chidgk1 (talk) 14:48, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nice list and great graphic. You might consider some of the following: G. Moore 23:40, 5 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• I analyzed the page for dead links. This added some archiving of 47 links

Thanks - I have never done anything with archiving - if anyone thinks automatic archiving might not be enough let me know and I will read up on manual archiving.

• I think that the first cell in each row would look better if it was left aligned, ie adding

|scope="row" style="text-align: left"|

Done

• Format external links and add accessdate, i.e.
  • "Interactive map of coal plants: Global Energy Monitor". Endcoal.org. Retrieved March 5, 2020.

Formatted but I think the access date in the licence query and co2 refs is enough as those will change over time.

• Notes column might be better as the last column. I would also include any references in this column.

Moved to second from last because very few people will need to read licence number - re refs if I put them all in that col it would not be obvious which cell they refer to e.g. the ref that Çan-2 type is combined cycle.

• the year and CO2 emission columns would be better right justified. Use a break, if there is additional text required. Generally, all numbers should be right justified.

Right justfied. Re additional text - should I have a row for each unit does anyone think?

• The open street maps link does pull up anthing because there are no coordinates on the page.

Removed co-ord mapping box as it seems not to find the co-ords in the map source

If you want the Open Street map to work, you would have to include the coords in the table. See List of plantations in North Carolina for an example. G. Moore 14:03, 6 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks - I think I may use that in individual articles about each plant rather than here as the map gives a general idea.

• Use the {{refn}}</ref> template for notes that should include references, ie Note 1 and 6. See List of North Carolina militia units in the American Revolution for an example of how this is done. Note 5 should be a complete sentence. G. Moore 14:03, 6 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done thanks

Resolved comments from ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:52, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

;Comments "As of March 2020" - we're in April now Removed months from "as of" as no one is going to update them monthly Coal fired or coal-fired? The title uses no hyphen but the first sentence uses one Removed hyphens and requested category rename Add a comma after Turkey in the first sentence Done Write gigawatt in full with (GW) in brackets the first time the term is used Done Same for TWh Done Second paragraph should not start with a number Done Explain CO2eq the first it is used, as above Replaced with the simpler "carbon dioxide" as that is what it is in this case - the source quotes CO2eq as they were also studying differently fuelled plants. "the plants are the largest contributor to greenhouse gas emissions by Turkey." - source? @ChrisTheDude: This is in the pie chart in the linked article. New figures were released yesterday, so I will make a new pie chart. Do you think I should put the new cite in the pie chart and then the new pie chart in this article? Or should I just cite the new figure? Or both? "Unlike neighbouring Greece, which is closing down all its lignite-fired power stations;" - should be a comma at the end, not a semi-colon Done "The main opposition party" - seems odd not to state which party this is Done "5 older plants" =? "five older plants" Done "As of February 2020" - as above, we're now in April Removed months from "as of" as no one is going to update them monthly "So public information on the carbon-dioxide emissions of individual plants may not be available until after Sentinel-7 satellites are launched in 2025." - this is not a complete sentence Combined previous sentence "Much of the operational fleet was built in the 21st century." - surely this extremely short sentence could be merged with another Combined previous sentence Also, what is "the operational fleet"? No explanation is given. "Operational fleet" is a bit tricky to define exactly at the moment, as we don't know yet how many of the plants which were shutdown on 1st January will be retrofitted with filters and restarted. If plants are restarted I will put them back in the list. But whether or not those plants are included the sentence is still true. "Also the price of natural gas fell in 2020" - "also" is not an appropriate word with which to start a sentence - needs rewording. Done What is "MW" in the map caption? Done "For details of annual capacity payments please see the list of important power stations in Turkey." - if this is an important piece of info, why is it not in the table? if it isn't important, this note is not needed. It is important and there are 2 reasons it is in the other list and not here. Firstly, although important in terms of money and GW, it is paid to a small number of large plants so if I put it here there would be a column with lots of empty cells taking up space. Secondly it is also paid to some non-coal plants, so others may wish to add those payments in future and I think it would be best to keep them in the same list. In the header of the table, there seems to be a huge gap between "operational capacity" and the brackets Fixed Is the "type" of many stations unknown? If not, why are there blank cells? Yes unfortunately I have not been able to find a source for the type of the small plants (under 100 MW) Same for coal type Yes unfortunately I have not been able to find a source for the coal type of many smaller plants And emission, for that matter Yes unfortunately I have not been able to find a source for the emissions of the smaller plants Some of the cells in the notes column where there is no actual note have a dash, others are just blank. Any reason? Another reviewer suggested I put dashes in all the blank cells so I have now done them all I think (left totals blank as they are not sortable - but can put dashes if anyone thinks that would be better) "Of the 6 x 165 MW units 2 units are shutdown and 4 units operating under temporary licence" => "Of the six 165 MW units, two units are shut down and four units operating under temporary licence" Done In that note you spell licence with a C, but elsewhere it is spelt with an S. Fixed ZETES notes should start with a capital L Done Note 1 - It is unclear why [4] says there are 67" - this looks awful with the ref like that. It would be better to write it as "It is unclear why the Turkish government says there are 67", with the ref at the end. Fixed In the same note, "shut down" is two words Fixed Note 2 - "On the original." This is not a complete sentence. I do not know why it is there/what it means. I hope it is now clearer - if not please let me know Note 6 - same comment as note 1 Fixed Quite a lot of work to do here, I fear........ -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 14:42, 12 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks to everyone who has commented so far. If I have not resolved your comments or you have more please let me know. Also it would be great if anyone who has not yet commented could take a quick look as I suspect there is more which could be improved. Chidgk1 (talk) 09:08, 14 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• It does not look right citing a newspaper report to say official figures on the number of power stations are wrong.

You are correct, however the newspaper was with 2 government ministers, and their number matches the number of entries in the Energy Market Regulatory Authority database (cited on column headers) which is also an official source.

• So why not give the Energy Market Regulatory Authority database as your source - although I realise you may also need the newspaper for the ones that are shut down. Dudley Miles (talk) 22:48, 16 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Might the difference in the figures be due to some power stations having more than one plant?

"Power plant" is a synonym for "Power station". "Station" is more common in British English. Maybe "plant" is more common in American English. Certainly some stations are very close together but on separate sites, such as ZETES-1, ZETES-2 and ZETES-3, however I have listed them separately. Whereas if I understand right if a station has multiple "units" they would be on the same site.

• Ref 5 does not support 47 power stations, so far as I can see.

Ah well spotted - I have moved ref 3 to a better place: 52 - 5 =47

• "over twice that of a gas-fired power station, so the power stations are the largest contributor to greenhouse gas emissions by Turkey" is not referenced.

Reference added

• "totalling almost 1 billion lira,[9][10] and in 2018 US$4.4 billion was spent on coal imports" Using two different currencies in conjuntion is unhelpful to the reader. I would provide a conversion of lira to dollars (at a specified date shown in a note).

Done - did not bother with note as very approx but can add if needed. Template:To USD has not yet had 2019 added - User:EncMstr has asked IMF but perhaps they have other priorities now!

• "to give lignite burning power stations dispatch priority" What does this mean?

Clarified the link to read "priority over other types of generation."

• "and despite abundant sun and wind, Emba Hunutlu is under construction" This is not supported by the reference.

Improved references

• I regret that I have to oppose due to the unreferenced non-WP:NPOV comments. Dudley Miles (talk) 13:09, 16 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Dudley Miles: Thank you for your useful review. Could you let me know if you spot any more unreferenced non-WP:NPOV comments. If I am unable to reference them I can easily remove them. Chidgk1 (talk) 16:52, 16 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• The referencing is improved but some comments in the lead still read as as POV opinions rather than a neutral encyclopedia article. Expressions such as "and despite abundant sun and wind", "although they will lose money" and "may create financial problems for power station operators" should either be omitted or attributed, just as the Republican People's Party claim is attributed.

I have attributed the comments and added reasoning in support of new lignite power:"The Turkey Wealth Fund, the country's sovereign wealth fund, is financing it because the country needs to maintain energy security by reducing fossil fuel imports.". I did not cite abundant sunshine as I assumed that is common knowledge - if any cites are still missing please let me know.

• The comment " perhaps they are confusing with the number of units or counting power stations which were shut down much earlier" is also unreferenced personal opinion. I suggest moving the note to after ref 4 and saying maybe: "The Energy Ministry gives a figure of 67 power plants, but does not list them and the Energy Market Regulatory Authority database lists 52.

Done

• There is an error in note 2 as it has a stray </ref>. I cannot open the source as I do not have a program to open a zip file on my current computer, but I assume that it is still a valid source.

Yes it is published in April each year and only the most recent spreadsheet within the zip is needed but I don't know any way to directly reference only that one

• smokestack measurements" should be linked or explained - and the relevance of Sentinel-7 satellites should be explained.

Done

• Do the dashes in the table mean information not available? I suggest replacing them with "Not known", except in the Notes column which should be blank if there is no note.

Done

• Thanks for your amendments. I am close to removing my oppose, but the lead is still a bit too much opinion rather than a neutral summary of facts. Dudley Miles (talk) 22:48, 16 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Looks fine now. Dudley Miles (talk) 20:37, 19 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Dudley Miles, ChrisTheDude, Reywas92, and G. Moore: - I suspect there is more needs to be fixed which I have not spotted.

Also fresh eyes may notice any readability issues - if other people have a chance to look at this.

• I have no idea what the lettered footnotes point to to even start looking at their reliablity

@Guerillero:

Yes note 4 was confusingly written. If it is still unclear please let me know.

• Greenpeace isn't a RS

Replaced with Nature

• You are using three citation methods

I have removed "harvid". In general I was trying to use the automatic cite generation on the visual editor as that was easiest for me as the writer. But for long documents I thought I ought to list them in sources. But I would welcome advice if there is a better way.

• Climate Transparency isn't an RS

Replaced with FT

• Health and Environment Alliance isn't an RS

Removed as duplicate as the fact is cited in the government source in the refs column

• coalexit.org isn't a RS

It is only to cite that Diler is on their list

I'm going to assume all of the Turkish sources are reliable --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 15:39, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Chidgk1: What does EÜ/4969-240/2940 mean? Also, I would remove the totals column --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 18:19, 5 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Totals removed. EÜ/4969-240/2940 is the number of a licence allowing the power station to operate. As every row has a licence number, rather than explaining in every row how to query the database I would like to explain in one place. But if you as an expert Wikipedian looking at this for the second time are not getting it then a new reader will have no chance. Therefore I obviously need to clarify more. On the other hand I don't think it should be in the main text because only a few readers will need to verify the info. Possibly what is obscuring the important point about querying a single plant is that originally I was trying to query all coal-fired power stations because it was very hard to identify the small ones. But that query will likely not be needed so much in future as I am almost certain no new small coal plants will be built. So I will split that off into a separate note. I wonder if I can also put a screenshot in the footnote.

@Guerillero: Amended footnote and added screenshot. Is that clear to new readers now? Any more questions or suggestions?

Perfect! Support --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 14:28, 6 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

As [this screenshot] is being proposed for deletion can you understand the refs column without looking at it? Chidgk1 (talk) 16:27, 10 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't get a chance to see it before it was deleted... The Rambling Man (Stay indoors, stay safe!!!!) 08:41, 6 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Structure is still a bit weird, five lead paragraphs is contrary to MOS:LEAD.

combined first two paras as both were very short

• "Lignite (brown coal) is mined locally, whereas almost all hardcoal" are both required? It's unclear to me.

@The Rambling Man: Sorry what is unclear? I have been looking at this article for so long it is hard to see it from the point of view of a first time reader.

• I'm not clear about why we're discussing this, i.e. perhaps say something like "coal-fired power stations require both lignite and hardcoal" or similar before saying where they're sourced. The Rambling Man (Stay indoors, stay safe!!!!) 08:02, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent - This is exactly the kind of comment I need where something is unclear to a reader new to the subject. Rejigged to I hope imply that a particular power station almost always either burns lignite or hardcoal and is not switched (there was an exception which I think was brief but I cannot now find the newspaper article) - if still unclear please tell me and I could write it more explicitly e.g. I could put in text "a particular power station almost always either burns lignite or hardcoal and is not switched". Chidgk1 (talk) 08:37, 10 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• What's thermal coal?

linked to definition

• " near local coalmines," we don't normally link to categories.

@The Rambling Man: I thought the link might be useful to the reader, as it can be hard to find info on Turkish coal mines. But if there a problem with linking to the category I will unlink it. Should I?

• It could be a "see also" I suppose. The Rambling Man (Stay indoors, stay safe!!!!) 08:02, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

moved to "see also" Chidgk1 (talk) 08:44, 10 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• "Five old power " old? What does that really mean?

quantified "old" as "20th century"

• "remains shutdown as" shut down.

changed

• "building[17] Afşin-Elbistan C" move that ref.

moved

• Too many refs mid-sentence, makes for poor reading experience.

@The Rambling Man: On the other hand it is easier to check the cites that way because you know exactly which cite is for which piece of info. Is the reading experience that bad it outweighs the ease of cite checking? Again hard for me to tell as I have read it that often.

• For me, the jarring placement is worse than waiting to the end of the sentence or some mid-sentence punctuation to find the ref. The Rambling Man (Stay indoors, stay safe!!!!) 08:02, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

moved refs after punctuation Chidgk1 (talk) 08:50, 10 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• "list of important power stations in Turkey." important? That's pure POV.

removed "important"

• "Captive power plant No output to grid Jan-May 2020" needs some punctuation and compliance with MOS:DASH.

changed

• Do blank cells mean not known? If so, say it.

changed

• Notes column don't usually need to sort, there's little use in sorting free text.

removed sort

• In sortable tables, linked items should be linked each time.

done - if anyone spots any I have missed let me know or link

• Several notes include inline external links which we don't do.

changed to refs

@The Rambling Man: Is there a problem with that?

• We just don't put external links as part of the prose. Either format them as references or add them as external links, but notes have to be verifiable either way. The Rambling Man (Stay indoors, stay safe!!!!) 08:02, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Ref 46 is showing an error.

I cannot see an error message - maybe someone else or a bot fixed it

• Second source has a spaced hyphen when it should be an unspaced en-dash.

I cannot see that error - maybe someone else or a bot fixed it

• Template:Power stations in Turkey doesn't have a link to this article so the template shouldn't be there.

linked to this article

That's all I have on a really quick pass, it's an oppose for now. The Rambling Man (Stay indoors, stay safe!!!!) 08:41, 6 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@The Rambling Man: I think I have covered all your comments so far. Can you let me know what else I need to do to bring it up to scratch please? Chidgk1 (talk) 16:31, 10 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

More comments on the lead

• "around 50 coal-fired power stations in Turkey with a total capacity of about 17 gigawatts (GW), generate" - there is no reason for that comma after the brackets
• "However those burning lignite tend to be near local coalmines" - don't think the first word is needed
• "Turkish lignite is very low quality" => "Turkish lignite is of very low quality"
• "Lignite burning power stations" => "Lignite-burning power stations" (and later in the sentence too)
• "has applied to the government for them to be shutdown" => "has applied to the government for them to be shut down"
• "So public information on the carbon-dioxide emissions of individual power stations may not be available" => "Public information on the carbon-dioxide emissions of individual power stations may therefore not be available"
• "Much of the operational fleet was built in the 21st century: however" - colon should be a comma
• "and 2020 drop in demand" => "and drop in demand in 2020"
• I'll take another look at the table later..... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:25, 12 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks - I changed most to your suggestions - but for one or two I thought you must be American until I looked at your profile - perhaps you have been more influenced by the USA than me. Or maybe British English has changed since I left a decade ago. Chidgk1 (talk) 18:12, 12 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Why do you say that......? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 17:26, 13 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry didn't mean to be rude - it was a bit of a throwaway comment. By the way if it is easier for you feel free to make copyedits directly on the article. I am unlikely to revert anything unless it accidentally changes the meaning. But if there is anything time consuming or difficult for a new reader to follow or anything else which needs fixing please let me know. Chidgk1 (talk) 16:53, 16 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Chidgk1: don't worry, I didn't take offence, I was just curious as to which of my suggestions gave you the impression that I was American? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:42, 17 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It was the third one - but even though I thought "of" was redundant it was still useful as it prompted me to find some actual figures. I now need a coal expert to say whether over 5 kg of CO2 per kWh generated is the highest in the world. If I offer a bet that it is would anybody reading this take me up on it?

What still needs to be done please? Chidgk1 (talk) 16:27, 19 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Noted a few things:

• add a comma after "For details of annual capacity payments"

Done

• is it necessary to clarify that lignite is (brown coal)?

I think it is worth the extra 2 words to avoid some readers needing to click the link. Because "lignite" is a fairly unusual word I suspect many readers would not know the meaning.

• could you rework and clarify the sentence "A court order to shut 3 polluting power stations in the 1990s was not enforced." Was the court order in the 1990s? Or did the order want them shut down by the 1990s?

The source says that in "1996 the Aydın Administrative Court issued an interlocutory injunction for suspension of the power plants' operation" - I am not a lawyer but if I understand that right it means that the court ordered that the plants stop generating immediately while the court case(s) were ongoing - so the answer to your question is "both" - but I am reluctant to make the sentence any longer in this article (it could perhaps be said in more detail in one or more of the articles on the individual plants) - if you or anyone can improve it please be bold and do it.

How about: "A 1996 court order to shut 3 polluting power stations was not enforced." ~ HAL333 13:52, 21 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done thanks

There is some ironic humor later in the source in that the polluting power stations did not get closed but some local farmers did receive compensation for damage to their tobacco crops! The 90s were a different age!

Nice job overall. ~ HAL333 03:07, 21 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Support I think I’m set for life in terms of familiarity with Turkish coal power-plants. I would appreciate if you could check out Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/Woody Harrelson filmography/archive1. Thanks! ~ HAL333 14:45, 21 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments First of all, congratulations on nominating your first list to FL status – it's always nice to see some new faces around here. From a quick look over the list, I think this might be a difficult one to get up to FL-standard, particularly on the English Wikipedia.

• My first issue is with the sourcing. It's a shame that so few of the references contain wikilinks to the articles on the publishers – this would make it easier to check the reliability of the citations. Oxford Institute for Energy Studies, Vox, Daily Sabah and Kathimerini are the first few I saw in the references that could be easily wikilinked. Once all the publishers have been wikilinked, it'll be easier to review the sources.

Done - if there are difficulties with particular sources please let me know which so I can try to find alternative sources.

• There's a real lack of clarity and certainty in the prose of this article, which unfortunately begins right from the very first sentence ("Around 50 power stations with a capacity of about 17 gigawatts generate about a third of the electricity"). It's a shame that we can't even say for certain how many active coal-fired power stations there are in Turkey – the Energy Ministry says 67, the Energy Market Regulatory Authority says 52, but the table onlt lists 50. This feels like a really basic fact that a featured list should be able to state clearly. "However" is listed in WP:EDITORIALIZING as a word to watch – it appears five times in this article.

Removed "however". Redefined the list as not including pure autoproducers - thus (barring errors) the exact number of stations is now in the first sentence Because pure autoproducers don't need licenses so I cannot be sure there are none.

• The map might be better served in its own level 2 header un the table, rather than tacked on at the end of the lead.

Moved as suggested but I am guessing it does not need a header as I suppose screen readers would be able to read the caption.

• "For details of annual capacity payments, please see the list of power stations in Turkey." -> Put {{For|details of annual capacity payments|list of power stations in Turkey}} directly under the "Active coal-fired power stations in Turkey" header instead.

Done

• "wikitable sortable" -> "wikitable plainrowheaders sortable"

Done but I could not understand from the "Layout of table headers" subsection in Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Accessibility/Data_tables_tutorial why we want to do that

• The Station column is really cluttered and confusing – I don't think there's any need to include all three names by which a power station in known. Just pick whichever is the WP:COMMONNAME and use that.

The reason for including all the names is that different sources use different names so if I take them out completely it may be confusing for future editors.

But you are right they are clutter - perhaps I should move them to be with the licence numbers?

• On a related note, having 50 footnotes, each containing nothing more than a station's license number, isn't very aesthetically pleasing. I realise that it's necessary to include the license numbers so that readers can verify data for themselves on the Turkish Energy Market Regulatory Authority. Perhaps a compromise might be to include the license numbers in a small font under the station names18 Mart Çan a.k.a. Çan would become 18 Mart Çan<br /><small>(EÜ/101-44/020)</small>. Let me know what you think of this idea.

I moved them out of the table in response to a previous comment. Although I see your point I feel they should remain in the footnotes because such a tiny proportion of readers will actually need them. I guess very few readers will actually look at the footnotes and there is so much info in the table already I am reluctant to add more unless it is really useful.

• Where is the construction/operational start year sourced from? The first one that I checked is Cenal, which is listed in the table as 2017, but, when I check the Turkish Energy Market Regulatory Authority database, the only years that I can see are 2013 and 2062.

For the small stations it is generally from the EMRA database as there is no other source. But for large and medium stations (like Cenal) your question leads to a wider discussion which I will ping you with below.

• Is that the standard way or presenting provice and district in Turkey, with one on top of the other? I'd have thought that, for example, "Çanakkale, Çan" would be clearer than "Çanakkale" on top of Çan".

I just did it like that to make the column narrower as there are so many columns - if you or others have a strong opinion let me know and I will change it.

• Note 6: rather than wikilinking to a separate article, it might be a good idea to provide a sample calculation so that readers can follow the working themselves.

I would rather stick with the link as it goes directly to the sample calculation in the other article - which is good and needed there also I think - don't want to just duplicate it here.

• Citations 6, 21, 26, 36, 37 and 39 aren't working.

Fixed

• Citations 11 and 13 are missing publishers (for 11 it's Routledge; for 13 it's the Council of Europe). There may be others.

Fixed

• Per MOS:ELLIPSIS, precomposed ellipses characters (…) should be replaced with three periods (...).

Fixed

• [[Ministry of Environment and Urban Planning (Turkey)]] -> [[Ministry of Environment and Urban Planning (Turkey)|Ministry of Environment and Urban Planning]]

Fixed

• There is a lot in this article that isn't standard for a featured list. I don't think I've ever seen a FL that includes wikilinks in the column headers of a table, and I've certainly never seen one that links to a Google Translate version of a web source or instructs readers to tick "I am not a robot". For this reason (and the reasons above), I feel that this article needs more discussion before it's promoted, so I'm afraid that I oppose for now. A Thousand Doors (talk | contribs) 17:52, 21 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I suspect very few readers click the wikilinks or look at footnotes. It seems unlikely the footnote explaining how to query the source will distract casual readers, but for someone using the article as a starting point for research the query explanation could save a minute or two of their valuable time.

@A Thousand Doors: Thank you very much for those valuable comments. Related to your comments and my replies above about the Station and Start Year columns I am wondering whether there should be a row for each active unit. The larger stations usually consist of several units often built and closed down at different times. This would make the info about units currently in the notes column machine readable and would allow easy cross ref with the "table" tab on https://endcoal.org/tracker/. However it would increase the number of rows and the size of the Station column. Looking forward to further comments from you and anyone else on this or anything else. Chidgk1 (talk) 11:14, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Looks good to me. Jimknut (talk) 17:54, 30 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks @Jimknut:. If you mean the whole article looks good please could you support it being a featured list by writing "support" in bold. Or are you replying to the above question by saying a "units" column would look good? Or both? Chidgk1 (talk) 19:31, 30 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Closing note: This candidate has been archived, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Giants2008 (Talk) 22:22, 19 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.

The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was archived by Giants2008 via FACBot (talk) 00:25, 6 July 2020 (UTC) [2].[reply]

---

Nominator(s): Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 11:19, 10 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I am resubmit this nominating for featured list of List of awards and nominations received by Britney Spears because the last time I've been here in December 2019 and it takes me about 3 months long to improve my work and I think this page maybe already near the FL criteria better than my last time. Let me know which part that still I need to be solve and make improvements. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 11:19, 10 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:25, 22 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

*Drive-by comment - the lead seriously needs editing by someone whose first language is English and who isn't such a Britney superfan. Stuff like "She received the MTV Video Vanguard Award [...] for her Iconic Performances, Iconic Career, Huge Influence, and Impact On Music, Great Discography and Breath Taking Music Videos" is completely unencylopedic and not really coherent English, and "she became the First Teen female artist in history" is just nonsense -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 12:00, 10 March 2020 (UTC)[reply] More specific comments on the lead "Spears is regarded as a Pop Icon, World Princess of Pop, Fashion Icon, and Pop Legend and is credited by critics with influencing the revival of Teen Pop during the late 1990s." - all unsourced and wholly inappropriate and unencyclopedic PR-type nonsense. I find it hard to believe that many people really think of Spears as a "fashion icon", and the other three basically all mean the same thing. "She is a pioneer." - of what? Completely meaningless. "Besides, Princess of Pop is an honorific nickname most commonly associated with Britney Spears" - unsourced, completely inappropriate for an encyclopedia and debatable whether it's even true. "she became the First Teen female artist in history" - unless there are quite a few words missing, this is just nonsense "garnered honorific titles including the "Queen Of Pop", "Empress Of Pop" and "The Ultimate Femme Fatale Pop Icon."" - more PR rubbish which does not belong in an encyclopedia even if sourced "No. 1 at the US Billboard 200 chart[1]." - "on the chart", not "at", also the ref should do after the punctuation "The album spawned worldwide massive hits" - peacock terms which really need to be re-written "all the 5 singles in this album peaked at Billboard 100 chart" - doesn't make any sense Why is Grammy Awards in italics? "the album also was nominated for Grammy Awards in the Best Female Pop Vocal Performance and holds the record for[...] best-selling teenage artist of all time" - how can an album hold this record? "fastest most no. 1 in UK chart" - I don't even understand what this is meant to mean "holds the record for [...] 5th Best Selling Female Artist in Music History" - you can't hold the record for being fifth best at something TBH, given that I found all of those issues in less than two paragraphs, I think the article needs such a major overhaul that at this point it's an oppose from me........... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:02, 13 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose – agree with Chris. Get this copyedited by someone efficient in English and isn't a superfan. Plus, date formats are inconsistent, lead is a mess, many refs don't seem like RS's (Abolutebritney.com obviously seems like a fan site), among other things. – zmbro _(talk) 19:47, 15 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Note to the director/delegates - the nominator has attempted to archive this nom him/herself, which I am pretty sure isn't allowed, so I have reverted, but he/she clearly wants to withdraw it..... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 20:43, 21 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Noted. I've fixed it as described by ChrisTheDude and zmbro. First, lead is a mess and I've made a whole new lead which is better than before. Secondly, all the dates now are consistent. Again, let me know which part that I need still to fix it. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 15:17, 25 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Johhnyfrankie13: as suggested before, please please please get someone whose native language is English to copy-edit the lead (I suggest trying WP:GOCE). I counted at least 10 grammar errors in the first two paragraphs....... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 21:16, 25 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: I've already put the copy-edit template on the top of the award's page, but it's been 4 days since I put the template and nothing has changed. I'm sorry if I was wrong because I'm still new to Wikipedia. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 04:28, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No problem, let's see if you get a response -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 17:53, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Zmbro: & @ChrisTheDude: already get the copyedited and done. Okay, so can I add the BDS Certified Awards, Vevo Certified Awards, and Phonographic Performance Company of Australia into the award table?. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 23:27, 20 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Zmbro: & @ChrisTheDude: Hi, please response. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 23:29, 21 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• The lead certainly looks a lot better now, I will do a proper review later -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:25, 22 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Refs are still a problem. Few missing access dates and and there are still some missing in the table. – zmbro _(talk) 13:47, 22 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• There's also some sources which look highly questionable in terms of reliability e.g. alexintvseriesland.altervista.org, funtrivia.com, top40-charts.com. And what the heck is ref 336 - some sort of online PowerPoint presentation? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 12:17, 24 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: the sources for Guinness World Records is done. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 08:36, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments on the new lead

• My only comment on the new lead is this:
  • "In December 2019, Billboard named her the sixth Greatest All Time Pop Songs Artist, the fifty-eighth Greatest All Time Artist, and ranked her at seventy-first place on the list of Artists of the Decade 2010s." - get rid of all this. Being named the 58th greatest artist is not a significant achievement at all -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 18:16, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: Done. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 19:20, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Starting on the table (this could take a while :-))

• The sorting on the "work" column is mostly wrong. Any entry which is "Britney Spears" (the person) should sort under S, not B. Any entry that starts with puncuation (quote marks, dots, etc) should sort on the first actual word. Anything that starts with "The" should sort on the next word.
• 4Music - "World Greatest Popstar" => "World's Greatest Popstar"
• Bambi Award => Bambi Awards
• Billboard mid-year - "New Music From Britney Spears" - Music and From should not have capital letters
• Billboard Music Award => Billboard Music Awards
• Bizarre => Bizarre Awards, also the award she won was for Woman of the Year (not Women)
• BRIT Awards - I am reasonably sure that Britney was *not* nominated for British Pop Act, for fairly obvious reasons (the award was called Best Pop Act, not British Pop Act)
• CD:UK - the award column is missing completely
• Golden Raspberry Awards - "Most Flatulent Teen-Targeted Movie" - this was an award for the film, not Britney, so has no reason to be here
• MTV Awards - by the look of things, neither of these was awarded to the film itself, so it should not be the film's title in the work column. It should probably say "Britney Spears (for Crossroads)
• MTV Italy - her name is spelt "Britnet" in one place
• I got as far as M and I need a break :-) Back for more later..... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:06, 3 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

More table comments

• Upon trying to resume at N, I noticed that none of the links in the table of contents from N onwards seem to work
• Outer Critics Circle Award - the nominees were Spears and the other two women, not the show itself, so name them in the table, not just in a footnote
• Pepsi - what awards are these? Just saying "Pepsi" and linking to the article about the brand is not very helpful
• Stinkers Bad Movie Awards - the nominees were Spears and Mount, not the movie itself
• Teen Choice Awards - Choice Breakout Movie Actres - as per above, the nominee was Spears, not the film itself. Also actress is spelt wrong.
• Any award starting with The (eg The Record of the Year) should be alphabetised under the next word, not under T
• Don't have an external link to britneyspears.com in the table
• XM Satellite Radio Awards - the award was not called "Dream Duets (with Snoop Dogg)", so his name should not be in that column
• That's what I've found, although I probably missed something......... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:27, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments on the state honors table

• Outstanding Archivement - spelt wrong
• Key to the Vegas should be Key to Las Vegas, I would have thought -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 18:20, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: According to your comments above, this is all done. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 19:33, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

According to your comments above, this is all done - it is not all done. The sorting on the work column is still mostly wrong -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 19:59, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: Done! Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 21:09, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It is only partly done. You still need to change the sorting for anything that starts with a punctuation mark. At the moment ...Baby One More Time sorts at the top because punctuation marks come before letters. But it should sort based on the first actual letter (B). The same goes for anything that starts with a " - it should sort based on the first actual letter (so for example "Womanizer" should sort under W). Hope that helps -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:45, 5 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: Thank you for your explanation, and now is all done except I'm still finding the sources for the remaining boxes. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 10:04, 5 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: and @Cowlibob:, @Dey subrata:, @CAPTAIN MEDUSA:, can you guys review this page because I believe it satisfies the Featured list criteria. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 08:32, 6 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Medusa

Resolved comments from ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSAtalk 19:28, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Spears, Britney Why are you linking July 10, April 24, November 5 The ref is consistent. The first table uses {{Abbr|Ref(s).|References}}, second+third use {{Abbr|Ref.|Reference(s)}} Mr. and Mrs. Britney → Mr. Kevin and Mrs. Britney should be added Why are their soo many white spaces in the table???

• add alt text for the main image
• YouTube  · ibtimes.com  · gettyimages  · are not reliable sources.
• Don't use small text in the caption. It already makes it small.
• In the infobox it says she won 235 awards but she only won 182 according to the list?
• In the infobox it says she was nominated for 490 awards but she only was nominated for 296 awards according to the list?
• website=billboard.com → website=Billboard
• MP3 Music Awards links to MP3. What does this mean??????
• class="wikitable sortable plainrowheaders" sortable=yes → no need to add sortable=yes because the sortable plainrowheaders does the job

• • That's it for now. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 14:26, 6 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@CAPTAIN MEDUSA: So for, all of your comment are mostly resolved also the reason I have a lot of space in reference because I have OCD which I think is more organized when there is distance, I'm so sorry for that. Johhnyfrankie13 (talk) 12:40, 7 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Saiff Naqiuddin: I have closed the resolved comments. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 19:28, 11 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@CAPTAIN MEDUSA::

• Y "In the infobox it says she won 235 awards but she only won 182 according to the list?" → the number of awards she won included 14 Golds, 4 Silver, 1 Bronze, 8 Runner-up, 14 places, and 13 Guinness World Records (runner-up, place considered wins in this award tally).
• Y MP3 is the major organization of those awards (MP3 Music Awards)
• Y YouTube  · ibtimes.com  · gettyimages  · are not reliable sources → changed to reliable sources
• Y website=billboard.com → website=Billboard|
• Y add alt text for the main image
• Y Don't use small text in the caption. It already makes it small
• Y class="wikitable sortable plainrowheaders" sortable=yes → no need to add sortable=yes because the sortable plainrowheaders does the job

— Saiff Naqiuddin (talk) 18:54, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

MP3 is a file format. It is not an organisation -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 18:22, 13 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose

• The text needs work. It is choppy and the tone is off
• Barbie award is non-notable
• Flickr links are a copyvio
• CelebMix describes itself as "CelebMix is maintained by young people, for young people. In essence, Celebmix is a sandbox for aspiring journalists."; not a RS
• "Votação recorde no nosso prêmio anual: 25 mil votos. Confira o resultado" needs a publication.
• "Brazil Music Awards 2004 Britney Spears" links to a self-uploaded partial screenshot with broken embedded images
• Capital Radio Awards is unsourced
• CDDB Silicon Awards is non-notable. The Wikipedia page lined to is for a protocol, not an organization
• CD:UK's award can't be Britney Spears
• DanceStar Awards goes to a completely different awards page
• GV Music & Fashion Awards is non-notable. Viewcount does not show notability
• MP3 Music Awards is non-notable.
• Music Video Production Association Awards is non-notable.
• Neil Bogart Memorial Fund is non-notable.
• Now! Awards list the citations with the award. Playing pin the source on the fact isn't optimal
• Pepsi Awards looks like it was created for the marketing campaign and not a real award
• None of the Pop Corn Music Awards pages seem to be cited to anything but themselves. I'm going to place this in the non-notable group
  • Alamy is a photo company, not a RS
• "Spanish Music Producers Awards" links a copyvio copy of Billboard.
• Hochman 2014 isn't an RS because he is a contributor not a staff member
• Star Search the award doesn't appear to be one of their categories and I have doubts that this is an award
• Virgin Media Music Awards are questionable
• Mousekeeter isn't an award
• The Webbies don't appear to be given to Spears herself
• Z Awards are non-notable.
• Miss Talent USA is non-notable
• The failed Britney Spears Days are really puffed
• "Item inside Britney Spears Kentwood Historical & Cultural Museum" has no content and appears to be self-published
  • Link to the wrong Kentwood
• Outstanding Achievement Honor by Hammond Square Mall is non-notable
• Outstanding Achievement in The Mickey Mouse Club is non-notable
• "'Britney Day' Held To Celebrate Britney Spears' Las Vegas Show" needs a better source
• Most Searched Person on the Internet has to be a former record
• Hurst 2003 needs to have the series
• None of the Cite foo templates are displaying the year in the correct place

--Guerillero | Parlez Moi 21:02, 22 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Guerillero: I will fix the better sources for several awards provided above but what do you mean by non-notable since like "Miss Talent USA" was an honor to spears when she was young, and the sources I put is satisfied Notability which is from the book. First, we must add an award that only has articles on Wikipedia but if the award does not have a page, we can link to the major organization to backing it up (like Barbie, Pepsi, etc). Second, the award show must meet WP:GNG and WP:ORG and it will already become qualifies as notable. Saiff Naqiuddin (talk) 11:39, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Closing note: This candidate has been archived, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Giants2008 (Talk) 21:39, 5 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.